Hyundai Rock X800 8" RK3066 Vs Gemei G6 A comparison + discussion of the X800 'issues'
Posted 30 January 2013 - 09:09 PM
A little background though, I have a retail store and sell tablets here, so I've had a little experience. I have handled Gemei G6 & G9mt, as well as Q88+ and a couple of others, and got in a X800 as a sample to play with and see if it will be worth carrying, as I haven't been super impressed with the Gemeis
First off, it is a plastic case, not aluminium like the Gemei, but other than that, it meets or exceeds all the Gemei specs.
The IPS screen is much "nicer to look at" as in, it's easier on the eyes, and being IPS it doesn't suffer from the TFTs 'negative' distortion if you get to far from dead center viewing. The maximum brightness is a little lower than the Gemei , but at the same time the minimum brightness is significantly lower which is a very good thing, as I always found the Gemei too bright, especially lying in bed at night reading, where it would be burning my eyes right out of my head even turned down to minimum. This should also improve battery life with the screen turned down lower. As a guide, the X800 set to 50% is about the same as the Gemei set to minimum, and the X800 at 100% is similar to the Gemei on 90%
So far I haven't had any issues with the touch matrix, that others have reported.
I had never been impressed with the speaker/s in the Gemei, mounted in the back, facing away from the user, the sound quality was always poor and volume level pretty low. I found t6he volume and sound quality to be a lot better on the X800 with the side mounted speaker, especially if you cup your hand while holding the unit from the side, effectively bouncing the sound round towards you, which is something you cant do with the Gemei. The earphone socket however is the other way round. The Gemei had always sounded fine when using earphones, but the volume level on the X800 with the same earphones is about a THIRD to a HALF what the Gemei produces, I can barely hear anything. I have not had any crackle or distortion from the earphones as others have reported though. Something I found lacking on the X800, and I'm not sure if this is a X800 thing or just a configuration thing that I can change, but the Gemei, and all the others I have used, had the little volume up/down icons next to the back/home/swap icons, but there are missing from the X800. I have searched to see if this is a configuration item that can be switched on/off, but had no luck. This isn't a HUGE issue as you can always use the physical buttons on the side, but just something I had become accustomed to, and now miss. Another thing that could just be configuration, or possibly an improvement in 4.1 over 4.0 is that you can now put icons right out to the edges of the screen on the X800, where the Gemei had a no-go-zone of about 1 icon size all the way round the outer edge of the screen. This lets you fit a few more items on the screen which I really like.
The Gemei is listed as a dual-core 1.2ghz or 1.5ghz, depending on where you read it, with Single or Dual-Mali400, again depending on where you read it. In reality, after checking several G6 and G9mt, testing shows they are running at 1.2ghz, and I have not been able to find any way to get them to go higher.
The X800 is listed as dual-core 1.6ghz with quad-core Mali400, and checks show the CPU is running at 1.6ghz, which is a 33% faster than the 1.2ghz. The scaling also shows that the speed is stepping up and down as load changes, with about 15% of the time at the full 1.6ghz on the X800, compared to the Gemei at its full 1.2ghz around 45% of the time. This shows me that the X800 CPU is cruising and doesn't have to work as hard, while the Gemei is at its limit most of the time. I don't know how to check the Single-Mali Vs Quad-Mali, but games do seem to run smoother on the X800, whether this is from the Quad-Mali or faster CPU I can't tell.
OK, here we see some issues, as others have noted, but here are my findings so far.
Depending on where you read it, I have seen the Gemei listed as anything between 3600mah and 4200mah, while the X800 is listed as 4400mah everywhere I have seen specs listed.
Both units 'appear' to have similar chargers, both in specs (5v 2a), and the plug itself is the same size and polarity. HOWEVER, while the Gemei, Q88, and other tablets I have played with, are all happy to use the same chargers, the X800 will ONLY charge from the charger that it came with. I have tried 3 different wall-to-plug chargers, and 2 different wall-to-USB with a 2 different USB charge leads, and get the same result with all of them. The X800 shows 'charging' and the screen has a slight flicker with about a 1 second cycle, up-down by about 2-3% brightness. But even leaving it plugged in for an hour, switched off, the charge level does NOT increase. This concerns me a bit, considering how often these little chargers go bang, what do we do if the original fails? I am going to send a question to the supplier about replacement chargers, and will see what response I get.
The Gemei came with Android Version 4.0.4, Firmware Version V2.34.004, Kernel Version 3.0.8 qhang@lzy-desktop#15, Build Number ICS.g24ref_40181.20120925
The X800 came with Android Version 4.1.1, Firmware Version (not listed), Kernel Version 3.0.8+ root@xingyu-desktop#44, Build Number RK30_ANDROID4.1.1-SDK-v1.00.00 rk30SDK-eng 4.1.1 ROCK X 20121103.160942 release-keys
Most of that is over my head other than the basic Android Version, 4.0.4 for the Gemei and 4.1.1 for the X800
SOME of the Gemeis I have handled came pre-rooted, but not all, and my attempts to root one that wasn't met with failure. The X800 did not come pre-rooted, and I have not yet attempted to root it. While I have a certain amount of basic user experience with these things, I have not yet 'delved deep' into the hacking side of things. The only reason I even wanted to rooot the gemei was to try to resolve the battery meter issue that I mentioned earlier.
In general, I like the Aluminium Case for the Gemei, it makes it feel 'stronger' and 'tougher', but the X800 is so much lighter, which is a big plus when reading for hours. It would just about feel like my wrist was breaking after a couple of hours reading on the Gemei, but not so much with the X800. The other thing I noted is that the X800 feels a lot more responsive. I didn't realy notice it till I went back to the Gemei after a few hours playing with the X800. The Gemei felt sluggish in comparison, even though it hadn't seemed that way before trying the X800. The pre-installed apps on the X800 are almost all Chinese, so it took a while to go through and remove all the stuff I couldn't use, and install English equivalents, where as the Gemei, while shipped IN Chinese Mode, was simple to switch to English language, and remove a couple of purely Chinese apps which were not vital. All in all, i think I would choose the X800 over the Gemei, it is lighter, bigger battery, easier on the eye, quicker, and whether everyone agrees or not, a 'brand name' is a big plus when selling them. Customers generally feel for confident if I say its a Hyundai rather than a name they have never heard of. But even just for myself, I would pick the X800 (excluding the issue below).
The Gemei has ALWAYS had a battery indicator issue, right from day one, on several of the units, there is a common fault where the battery meter will read 100% until it just dies with a flat battery, then show 99% while charging. There is a fix from Gemei "FIX100" which I have run, and this seems to sort out the issue, for a day or so, but then it will start to get unreliable, still reading 40% when it dies, etc, and a few days later it is back to the 100% the whole time. The X800 does not have this issue, the battery meter seems to run true, at least so far.
**** The X800 has so far failed to wake up about 4 times in the last day. I have been working with it, tapped the power button to put it to sleep, or even just put it down and its gone to sleep itself, come back an while later to find it will not respond to the power button. I do not know if it is Hung or completely powered down, as holding the power button for 10sec does not seem to work either. I have fiddled with it for several minutes trying long presses, short presses of the power button, shouting at it, nothing will wake it up. Eventually I plug it back onto its charger, and about 30 seconds later it starts up on its own, but the battery is not flat. It has even just done it now, while writing this post, and once it powered back on it is showing 38% battery still, so should not have 'died'. This one is REALLY concerning me. What happens when I go to a clients office and pull out my tablet to check their network configuration, or look something up, and the darn thing wont switch on? I can't ask for a power point to kick start it all the time. This one could be a deal breaker if it is a common issue, or do I just have a bad unit, or did I accidentally pull out something vital in my de-chinese-iffying effort? I'm open to suggestions here.
Posted 31 January 2013 - 07:11 PM
Last night, I spent about 4-5 hours straight using the X800. The Battery went from 98% down to 12%, which I suppose isn't too bad for 5 hours, but of course, we would like more... lol
About 3 hours of that was gaming, playing "The Tribez" and a "Tower Defence" type, which would have been using the CPU/GPU pretty well, the rest was reading, all of it was with the brightness turned right down to minimum. I might add for any manufacturers that are reading, it could still do with being able to go a bit lower on brightness. While it wasn't burning my eyes, it was still brighter than I would have preferred, and it would have been perfectly readable/usable a bit lower.
I put it to sleep with a tap of the button, then went to sleep myself.
This morning I woke 6 hours later, to find it did not wake up with a tap of the button. I tried a 10 second hold, and it booted up from a "powered off" state. Once it made it to the desktop, it showed the battery at 0%, gave the message to plug in the charger, then died. So it is likely that it ran through the remaining 12% overnight while asleep and powered down. I will try to leave a little more battery tonight, as I was hoping to look at the battery discharge graph to see how much it used, if it woke itself through the night, etc.
It's back on charge now, again with its own charger. I tried my "Gemei/everything else compatible" charger at home before coming into the shop but it didn't do anything. Once I plugged it in here with 'its own' charger, it immediately powered on and booted up, showing 0% and charging.
Last night I did notice the 'shadow effect' on the screen that a few others have mentioned. I didn't get any pics of it, but I will try to describe it.
The most noticeable instance was when I tapped the bottom right corner, where the clock etc is, to bring up the brightness/settings/WiFi/etc. As that black box slides up the screen you can see a slight darker line that extends from the top edge of the box, all the way across to the left edge of the screen, and the entire section of screen to the left of the black box was slightly darker than the rest. Sliding that options box up and down a few times made it very clear, like a faintly tinted section across the rest of the screen beside the black box as it slid up and down. Not a huge issue, but not something I would expect to see in the "latest technology IPS screen". I will also point out that I had the brightness turned right down, and didn't think to see if it had the same issue with the brightness turned up, so I don't know if this had any effect. I will try it tonight if I remember.
I'm Still searching for information on "what makes the original charger different from all the rest?" and wanting to find out if we can get more "original" ones.
Till Next Time.......
Posted 02 February 2013 - 04:18 AM
NOT SWITCHING ON ISSUE:
Last night I left 25% battery before turning in, and this morning it woke up at a touch of the button, with 8% battery left.
By the time I got to the shop for the morning it would not wake up no matter what I did with the power button, so I plugged it in to it's charger, and about 60 seconds later it powered up on its own. Checking the battery history, it showed a long fast decrease, presumably when I was playing/reading, followed by a long slow decrease, presumable through the night, than an instant drop from around the 10% mark down to 0. I take this to mean that the battery meter is not as accurate as we would have hoped, and its reading of 8% was incorrect as it apparently died a few minutes later.
I need a little feed back from general Android users here. I checked the battery history, and the section that shows screen, wifi, awake, etc, showed the screen on for some periods and off for others as you would expect when it is being used and when it is sitting unused. Same with the wifi, it showed as on sometimes, when I switched it on, and off other times, when I disabled wifi because I didn't need it. The troubling thing is the 'Awake' line. It shows the unit as being awake the whole time, never sleeping. Checking my Gemei, the Awake line almost exactly copies the Screen line, showing it was only 'awake' when I was using it, and 'sleeping' when it wasn't in use. Presumably this 'being awake' the whole time would increase battery usage. What I would like feedback on i this: do other peoplse tablets show 100% awake, or does it show awake when in use and sleeping when not? Does anyone know if a certain App could be responsible for 'keeping it awake' when its not in use? I don't THINK this is the issue, as I have the same Apps installed on both tablets, so if for example, my battery read-out widget, was causing the issue, I would expect both tablets to do it, not just the X800. I know that some people have mentioned their X800's 'waking up' on their own, and they believe the issue is related to having a TF card installed, so I removed the card, even though I have never seen the screen suddenly come on unexpectedly, to indicate it was 'waking up' on its own, but the 'Awake' line in the history is still unbroken, showing it is still awake 100% of the time regardless of the screen being on or not.
I did a little testing with the chargers, here is what I found.
I tried plugging the X800 in to a portable USB battery pack, the Gemei has always charged from it fine, but the X800 again did the thing where is says 'charging' but after 20 minutes the battery has gone down 2% instead of up, so once again, it THINKS it is charging but actually isn't. The fact that it thinks it is charging, tells me that it isn't a plug issue, as it is actually getting voltage in, so the plug must be making contact properly, so I decided to check voltage levels. The battery back reads a good steady 5.02v and never drifted, as you would expect from a battery. I tested 3 generic chargers that other tablets are happy with, and they read 5.12v, 5.16v and 5.17v, each with an occasional .01-.02v drift. The original or 'genuine' charger that came with the X800 read 5.48v! almost 10% above the listed 5v. I would like to ask anyone else out there with an X800, could you please test the output voltage from your charger and see if they are also on the high side. If they are, this could be the 'difference' I have been looking for. It is tricky to test with these tiny plugs as the center hole in the charge plug is so tiny, even a paperclip is too big to fit down it, so I had to strip a short piece of thin wire, in this case a twist-tie that came wrapped around the USB lead. I will try to to do a test with my test-bench variable power supply, which is fully regulated, and very accurate, and try tuning it to 5v and see if it charges, then at 5.5v and test again. I have a feeling that at 5v it will give the false 'charging' indicator, but at 5.5v I suspect it will actually charge. I will have to cut up a perfectly good charge lead to fit to the variable supply, to do this test though, so I hope it shows a result.
I'll report back on how this goes.
Posted 02 February 2013 - 04:27 AM
On the gemei and q88, etc, if you try to turn on the tablet when that battery is 'too low', you get a battery icon flashing in the middle of the screen for a few seconds, then it goes back off. So you know that the reason it won't switch on, is because the battery is flat. It appears that these other tablets hold a little bit in reserve, to still be able to give basic indicators. The X800 has nothing like this. If the battery is to low for it to start up, it simply does not respond, leaving you guessing as to why it won't start/wake up. This lack, is probably what has made the battery/charging issues I have been experiencing that little bit more frustrating, because you just never know EXACTLY what is going on, and have to guess/figure out why it isn't doing what you expect. Add to that, the 'false' charging indications, and you are quite literally 'left in the dark' trying to figure it out.
This post has been edited by LanZone: 02 February 2013 - 04:30 AM
Posted 04 February 2013 - 05:08 AM
Last night I did manage to get it to sleep successfully by removing the 32GB TF card I had plugged in, and then turning off notifications and auto checking of mail and facebook. I also had a weather app that was rather over-zealously checking for updates which I disabled. After about 30 minutes with the screen off I checked the battery and it showed (finally) a flat line (no discharging) and a gap in the 'awake' line which coincided with the screen being off. However, this morning (after charging) it's back to a constant awake state and steadily discharging battery.
So the 'awake' line on the X800 doesn't _always_ have to be showing - it really is representing an 'awake' state. In this respect, it's no different to other Android tablets - it's just that the X800 seems to have a problem and won't sleep properly. I've tried a couple of other methods (and apps) but nothing is working reliably to make this thing sleep. As other RK3066 tablets aren't all suffering the same problem (and they're pretty much 99% the same hardware) it seems like a firmware issue - so unless somebody has a hack that works, it might just mean waiting until Hyundai get their act together.
Posted 08 February 2013 - 03:48 AM
I pulled out my old Bench Power supply, only to find that something has taken up residence inside and used the voltage controller board as a toilet! So..... no variable voltage test. But, I did manage to get the X800 to accept a charge from another 'generic' charger, this one reading 5.34v, so it's a little high 'officially', and the highest 'generic' charger i have had, but it is playing into my theory that the X800 (at least my one) needs the slightly higher voltage to charge, and isn't happy with the standard 5v. I'm still looking for any info others may be able to add to this issue.
On the other issue, this weird problem where the tablet appears to just stop responding to the power button. I have tried to fault find this one further and come up with a working theory, but it's weird as hell.
Once the tablet is taken off charge, as long as it is used continually, it is fine, but once you let it go to sleep (or as close to sleep as this thing gets), it seems to hang and never come back. The only way out is to hold the power button for 10-15 seconds to try to force a power off. SOMETIMES this will work, sometimes it doesn't, and once it finally does, after several tries, it will then start up, and not have this problem again until it is connected to a charger again, which seems to spark the fault again, once it is disconnected. The worst failure I had took almost 5 minutes of continual, hold for 10 seconds, release for 10, press for 3 seconds, nope - no go, wait for 10 seconds, hold for ten seconds, wait for 10 seconds, press for 3 seconds, nope - still no go, wait for 10, hold for 10, etc, etc, till eventually, it started up in the 3 seconds press part of the sequence. It has done this EVERY DAY, the first time or second time it sleeps after coming off charge, but once the issue happens, and I get past it, that's it, its fine for the rest of the day, or until i put it back on charge. It never has this problem WHILE on charge though, so as I said, it's really weird.
Other than the insomnia (refusal to go to sleep properly, the apnea where it seems to die in its sleep, and the greediness wanting more voltage than the rest, I am pretty satisfied with the X800, and pretty impressed with the CPU/GPU 'grunt' of the X800. Games that struggled on the Gemei G6 run smooth as silk on the X800, for example 'The Tribes' had really choppy sound and music, and slightly jumpy graphics, is perfect on the X800. I also have to admit, that while I was concerned about the plastic back case instead of the Gemei's aluminium one, the back cover on the X800 is still in almost prestine condition, while the G6 is covered in scratches, so the plastic is keeping its appearance better then the aluminium which is showing every mark.
I'm going to continue to try to get to the bottom of the power issues with the X800, but considering I haven't heard of a single tablet yet, that is 'issue free', if I have to choose a list of issues to live with, the X800 isn't any worse than the others.
Posted 22 February 2013 - 10:56 AM
Has anyone tried to charge the battery through the USB port?
This post has been edited by jabby: 22 February 2013 - 10:58 AM
Posted 27 February 2013 - 08:04 PM
I havent tried this but will give it a go and report back on how successful it is or isn't.
I haven't tried it myself, but everything I have read is that this is not a function supported on ANY tablets. Charging is via the charge port only, not the USB.
Posted 27 February 2013 - 08:38 PM
I have fought with the power issues for a while now and think iI have the pattern sussed out, almost.
I still have the issue of the unit only Actually charging from it's own original charger, and only Pretending to charge from any other charger. The Generic one I had that was putting out slightly higher voltage went bang after a couple of days as most of the cheap generics do, so I wont be getting any more of those ones. So this leaves me still A/ scared that I will be up the creek if the original one fails, and B/ having to cart the charger to work/home, etc, where as with the Gemie etc, I can have one at home and one at work.
I still have the issue of it going into a Coma, instead of just sleeping. I have explored this a lot further and have come to the conclusion that 'sometimes' when it is asleep (when the screen is off, since it never officially sleeps acording to the log), it simply hangs or crashes. This is evidenced by the fact that there is no response to any buttons except a long (20 second type, power off) press on the power button, which shows no effect at all, but the following 6 second "power on" press now works. Trying a "power on" press without first doing the "power off" one doesn't work, so evidently the unit is still "on" but not responding. This issue seems to be sporadic as it doesn't do it all the time, and I have not been able to track it down to a specific app or anything like that. for eaxmple, The day before yesterday, every time I put the thing down and it went to sleep, when I picked it up again it would have hung, even if it had only been a few minutes. I had to power down/up 11 times in one day. Once i picked it up did the power cycle, put it down while it was powering back up and got called away, came back 5 minutes later and it was again hung, so I hadn't even started up any additional apps. Yesterday however, with similar usage paterns, it never hung once, it ran perfectly all day, with several sleep/wake cycles as I used it throughout the day. Today, it seems to be back to hanging everytime it sleeps again. One curious thing though is that it never hangs, while in use, and it never hangs when on charge, even if it sleeps. So the only way to be Sure that it will be ready to ge when I pick it up is to keep it on charge and only unplug it when I'm using it, and return it to the charger when I'm done, otherwise it may have hung when I next need it.
The "ghosting" on the screen has become a little more noticable, not sure if this is because I notice it more, or because it has actually gotten worse, but any time there is significant contrast between things on the screen, you will see ghosting to the left and right of it, for example, dark writing on a light background will result in a slightly shaded band the rest of the way across the screen. Still not a huge issue, but I hope this is simply poor manufacture/implimentation and not a characteristic of the new IPS technology. I rememeber 'cheap' TVs when I was a kid that would have ghosting (or that anoying buzz through the speaker) in high contrast images, but Ghosting essentially disapeared decades ago, I would hate to see it make a comeback in new Technology Advances.
The Headphone socket issue is also more noticable, and again, im not sure as above if it is worse or I just notice it more, but I find it is worse with higher volume. If the headphones are plugged in properly the audio is muffled and 'cavernous' or 'underwater'. I have found that if I pull the plug out a little, i can find a point where I get mono output in the headphones but it is strong and clear. I have been using my iPhone heaphones, and haven't had a chance to try it with something else, so it IS possible that this has something to do with it, so I need to test it further.
The back case, which I had looked down on, because it is plastic instead of aluminium has been a REALLY pleasant surprise. After all this time, and coping the same uasge as my Gemie, there is still not a single mark or any signs of wear, while the aluminium back of the Gemie can only be described as "totally trashed". All the text, serial numbers, etc, are still perfect on the Hyundai's plastic case while the serial number is harbly readable any more on the Gemie's aluminium. It's not just that you don't notice scratches because it's plastic, but even on close inspection, there aren't any, I'm simply amazed. On this score, I have done a total 180, in future I will be looking at plastic cases as more favourable over aluminium.
All in all, the main fault with this device is the "Hanging when sleeping" issue, followed by the poor "battery life due to not sleeping properly".
If these could be sorted, and I'm assuming that both are simply software related, This would be a simply awsom unit, but as it stands, it's not something I could possibly sell in my store and look my customer in the eye.
Does anyone know if Hyundai are likly to release a firmware update for this, or know where I would go to find this information?
Posted 28 February 2013 - 08:36 AM
Many tablets charge through their USB port. Kindle, Nook, Nexus and many others. There are a couple, whose name I can't recall right now, that have charging ports but also alow charging through the Usb port.
Posted 17 March 2013 - 08:33 PM
I'm going to continue to try to get to the bottom of the power issues with the X800, but considering I haven't heard of a single tablet yet, that is 'issue free', if I have to choose a list of issues to live with, the X800 isn't any worse than the others.
Hi, I am new to this forum and all the comments that have been made have been helpful for me to resolve the power issue. The X800 is very fussy regarding which charger to use, the charger which came in the pack (FJ-SW0502000N) is defective. It did not charge the tablet when attached with a UK converter, therefore I bought another UK charger to match the exact specs: 5V, 2A, 2.5x0.8mm connector. This did not work....
Researching the issue, I realised that the tablet is "greedy" (as stated above) but increasing the voltage beyond the specification WILL damage the components inside. Therefore I bought a "generic" multi-volt charger from Maplins with the following specifications: 5V, 2.5A(2500mA) with the required connector. link - http://www.maplin.co...er-supply-49063
And now it charges the tablet with no issues, no flickering on the screen and upto 100%. This is my first tablet and when charging it does wake up the tablet, I suspect this is normal.
The reason why this approach works is because, voltage is carried by the current. The tablet needs an increased current above that which is stated to actually charge the tablet. The increase in current is determined by the capacitor inside the tablet, therefore I suspect it is drawing above 2A, but less than 2.5A at 5V.